Serious Is lateral zygo reduction the only way to improve ES ratio by the means of shaving bone from the side of my face?

LebenistneHure

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I've come to realization that the reason my face looks off to me in the mirror is because my face is too wide laterally. I'd look fine if I could remove about 3-5mms off each side, like zygo shaving. Problem is, my zygos barely protrude, maybe like 2 mms max. There is no possibility of further reduction than that, right? I'd have to shave the top side of my skull jfl
 
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I've come to realization that the reason my face looks off to me in the mirror is because my face is too wide laterally. I'd look fine if I could remove about 3-5mms off each side, like zygo shaving. Problem is, my zygos barely protrude, maybe like 2 mms max. There is no possibility of further reduction than that, right? I'd have to shave the top side of my skull jfl
You have a choice of MSE, aging, narrowing your nose to help the appearance of it, bone shaving if you must, or wearing a curtains hairstyle.
 
RealSurgerymax

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Pictures are worth a thousand words...

Several surgeries can help by actually increasing Interpupillary Distance and give balance to ES Ratio. They are all still big surgeries but less than an orbital box osteotomy (all procedures listed here are SUBcranial) -
  • Facial Tripartite
  • Lateral Orbital Wall Decompression + Medial Orbital Wall Bone Graft + Superiolateral Orbital Rim Shave + BOB Canthoplasty
  • Maxillary U-Shaped Osteotomy
  • Subcranial Facial Bipartition (LeFort III Bipartition)
  • Potentially SAD (Spring-Assisted Distraction) Frontoplasty with MSE (The SAD Frontoplasty is only successful in infants in children but maybe it will expand MSE expansion higher up. At worst it will probably do nothing...)

Illusions include nasal bridge narrowing. Botox to temploralis muscle may help some people. Weight loss seems to always help.

Maybe one of these solutions applies to you...
 
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Pictures are worth a thousand words...

Several surgeries can help by actually increasing Interpupillary Distance and give balance to ES Ratio. They are all still big surgeries but less than an orbital box osteotomy (all procedures listed here are SUBcranial) -
  • Facial Tripartite
  • Lateral Orbital Wall Decompression + Medial Orbital Wall Bone Graft + Superiolateral Orbital Rim Shave + BOB Canthoplasty
  • Maxillary U-Shaped Osteotomy
  • Subcranial Facial Bipartition (LeFort III Bipartition)
  • Potentially SAD (Spring-Assisted Distraction) Frontoplasty with MSE (The SAD Frontoplasty is only successful in infants in children but maybe it will expand MSE expansion higher up. At worst it will probably do nothing...)

Illusions include nasal bridge narrowing. Botox to temploralis muscle may help some people. Weight loss seems to always help.

Maybe one of these solutions applies to you...
Literally 0 people on this are low inhib enough to get these but I appreciate the thoroughness ngl
 
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Most people wont you are right. But I know for a fact some people here are signing up.
Really? I genuinely wouldn't have thought anyone from here would do, the most extreme surgery people seem to get from what I have noticed is Bimax, Sarpe and implants nothing really to do mechanisms in the midface. Well good luck to them I hope it goes well
 
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Pictures are worth a thousand words...

Several surgeries can help by actually increasing Interpupillary Distance and give balance to ES Ratio. They are all still big surgeries but less than an orbital box osteotomy (all procedures listed here are SUBcranial) -
  • Facial Tripartite
  • Lateral Orbital Wall Decompression + Medial Orbital Wall Bone Graft + Superiolateral Orbital Rim Shave + BOB Canthoplasty
  • Maxillary U-Shaped Osteotomy
  • Subcranial Facial Bipartition (LeFort III Bipartition)
  • Potentially SAD (Spring-Assisted Distraction) Frontoplasty with MSE (The SAD Frontoplasty is only successful in infants in children but maybe it will expand MSE expansion higher up. At worst it will probably do nothing...)

Illusions include nasal bridge narrowing. Botox to temploralis muscle may help some people. Weight loss seems to always help.

Maybe one of these solutions applies to you...
Omg I need your help so badly
 
LebenistneHure

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You have a choice of MSE, aging, narrowing your nose to help the appearance of it, bone shaving if you must, or wearing a curtains hairstyle.
Wouldn't MSE increase zygo projection, which is the opposite of what I want. I've read reports of people getting like 1-2mms of IPD expansion, but this might as well be a measuring error and is literally imperceivable. Yes narrowing my nose is a big one and would change the appearance of my entire face, that bulbous fuck.
 
Uglyandfat

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wearing curtain style hair is the safest, cheapest, and best method to hide subhuman es ratio
 
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Wouldn't MSE increase zygo projection, which is the opposite of what I want. I've read reports of people getting like 1-2mms of IPD expansion, but this might as well be a measuring error and is literally imperceivable. Yes narrowing my nose is a big one and would change the appearance of my entire face, that bulbous fuck.
MSE has been found to increase IPD for around 3mm which is relatively substantial in the grand scheme of things because it is a standard deviation in IPD measurements. Also most of the rotation from MSE comes from a increase in width of the malar palate connection by rotating it outwards it has very little effect on the outer zygomatic arches projection.

Narrowing your nose is the go to for most people howeverit depends on your ES ration and how messed up it is, also has to deal with a loss of harmony or betterment of such.
 
LebenistneHure

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Pictures are worth a thousand words...

Several surgeries can help by actually increasing Interpupillary Distance and give balance to ES Ratio. They are all still big surgeries but less than an orbital box osteotomy (all procedures listed here are SUBcranial) -
  • Facial Tripartite
  • Lateral Orbital Wall Decompression + Medial Orbital Wall Bone Graft + Superiolateral Orbital Rim Shave + BOB Canthoplasty
  • Maxillary U-Shaped Osteotomy
  • Subcranial Facial Bipartition (LeFort III Bipartition)
  • Potentially SAD (Spring-Assisted Distraction) Frontoplasty with MSE (The SAD Frontoplasty is only successful in infants in children but maybe it will expand MSE expansion higher up. At worst it will probably do nothing...)

Illusions include nasal bridge narrowing. Botox to temploralis muscle may help some people. Weight loss seems to always help.

Maybe one of these solutions applies to you...
Alright, you've given me a lot of food for thought. I've never even heard of most of these, so I got some researching to do. I'm still mostly interested in the surgery you mentioned once before, I think it was lateral orbital wall expansion, which would also increase palpebral fissure length. Would this surgery also increase IPD?

I would post a picture, but I can't get a good shot for the life of me, my camera either makes my ES ratio look normal, thus I look normal, or makes my face comically wide. In person would be the only solution I guess.
 
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Alright, you've given me a lot of food for thought. I've never even heard of most of these, so I got some researching to do. I'm still mostly interested in the surgery you mentioned once before, I think it was lateral orbital wall expansion, which would also increase palpebral fissure length. Would this surgery also increase IPD?

I would post a picture, but I can't get a good shot for the life of me, my camera either makes my ES ratio look normal, thus I look normal, or makes my face comically wide. In person would be the only solution I guess.
Most of these are incredibly invasive which is the major issue and will require a significant portion of downtime and effort in order to register for them, they will also be incredibly expensive for the most part.

If it increases palpebral fissure length in the way I believe it does it would end up with a result of the Iris being centred unlike an epicanthy (mis spelt but you get the idea)

Having a wider PFL also offsets the issue with ES ratio assuming the spacing between the eyes isn't narrow (as in doesn't fit an eye between your eyes)

Just take one specifically of your face from arms width away and take it and a flat expressionless angle with you looking at your hairline tends to produce easy to analyse results
 
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MSE has been found to increase IPD for around 3mm which is relatively substantial in the grand scheme of things because it is a standard deviation in IPD measurements. Also most of the rotation from MSE comes from a increase in width of the malar palate connection by rotating it outwards it has very little effect on the outer zygomatic arches projection.

Narrowing your nose is the go to for most people howeverit depends on your ES ration and how messed up it is, also has to deal with a loss of harmony or betterment of such.
Hmm, might give MSE a chance at least for better breathing, if anything. My face is pretty much the avi I got, but recessed around orbitals, no cheekbones, and slightly longer. I've also got something I'd call a two-face I guess, Friends made an episode about it. My face basically changes from lighting to lighting. I can either look 7psl, or 3psl. What I noticed is, when the light hits my face in such a way that my midface appears volume, visible lines etc., aka not flat but three-dimensional, and when my nose appears narrow, I look completely normal. On the other hand, when the light completely smooths out my facial lines, my IPD and long midface look death tier. It's ALL perception, and that good, because it means I can do something about it, if I can look good in certain light.
 
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Hmm, might give MSE a chance at least for better breathing, if anything. My face is pretty much the avi I got, but recessed around orbitals, no cheekbones, and slightly longer. I've also got something I'd call a two-face I guess, Friends made an episode about it. My face basically changes from lighting to lighting. I can either look 7psl, or 3psl. What I noticed is, when the light hits my face in such a way that my midface appears volume, visible lines etc., aka not flat but three-dimensional, and when my nose appears narrow, I look completely normal. On the other hand, when the light completely smooths out my facial lines, my IPD and long midface look death tier. It's ALL perception, and that good, because it means I can do something about it, if I can look good in certain light.
I mean a normal pic would be significantly better for us.

That is fair enough to be honest however it is difficult to place your issues whether it is more a case of long midface, ES ratio or just sheer recession around the eye area which would all need to be remedied in completely different ways simply put.
 
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I mean a normal pic would be significantly better for us.

That is fair enough to be honest however it is difficult to place your issues whether it is more a case of long midface, ES ratio or just sheer recession around the eye area which would all need to be remedied in completely different ways simply put.
Give me a sec, I'll post a pic.
 
LebenistneHure

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Alright, here. I hope I was able to present what I mean by different lighting. In one image it appears I have tiny cheekbones, midface doesn't look all too flat, and my nose appears to be a bit more narrow. In the other pic, completely opposite. Also, I tried doing the meme where I hold the phone as far away as I can, but you can still see my ears are almost sticking to the sides of my head, and that's not what it's like irl, so yes there has again been some distortion. This is as good as I can get it. So again, imagine my ES is slighty worse than this, because to myself, I look way better in pictures than in the mirror, precisely because of this minor ES improvement my camera "provides".




@RealSurgerymax
 
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Alright, here. I hope I was able to present what I mean by different lighting. In one image it appears I have tiny cheekbones, midface doesn't look all too flat, and my nose appears to be a bit more narrow. In the other pic, completely opposite. Also, I tried doing the meme where I hold the phone as far away as I can, but you can still see my ears are almost sticking to the sides of my head, and that's not what it's like irl, so yes there has again been some distortion. This is as good as I can get it. So again, imagine my ES is slighty worse than this, because to myself, I look way better in pictures than in the mirror, precisely because of this minor ES improvement my camera "provides".




@RealSurgerymax
If u shave you will look even more narrow. Your Es looks ok
 
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I've come to realization that the reason my face looks off to me in the mirror is because my face is too wide laterally. I'd look fine if I could remove about 3-5mms off each side, like zygo shaving. Problem is, my zygos barely protrude, maybe like 2 mms max. There is no possibility of further reduction than that, right? I'd have to shave the top side of my skull jfl
Another option would be temporal shell implants to make the zygos less protrusive. Unless your situation is very extreme, I'd think adding mass is always safer and more aesthetic than shaving bone off.
 
LebenistneHure

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Another option would be temporal shell implants to make the zygos less protrusive. Unless your situation is very extreme, I'd think adding mass is always safer and more aesthetic than shaving bone off.
Yeah, it would just make my face look plenty wider. It's not that my zygos are protruding, it's that my eyes are close set and narrow, so the area between the outer canthi and the side of my face is big, despite.
 
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Yeah, it would just make my face look plenty wider. It's not that my zygos are protruding, it's that my eyes are close set and narrow, so the area between the outer canthi and the side of my face is big, despite.
What is ur IPD
 
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Alright, here. I hope I was able to present what I mean by different lighting. In one image it appears I have tiny cheekbones, midface doesn't look all too flat, and my nose appears to be a bit more narrow. In the other pic, completely opposite. Also, I tried doing the meme where I hold the phone as far away as I can, but you can still see my ears are almost sticking to the sides of my head, and that's not what it's like irl, so yes there has again been some distortion. This is as good as I can get it. So again, imagine my ES is slighty worse than this, because to myself, I look way better in pictures than in the mirror, precisely because of this minor ES improvement my camera "provides".




@RealSurgerymax
And you want to be even narrower? Take a picture arms distance
 
Uglyandfat

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It does, in a picture. It looks worse irl.
yeah camera distortion tends to narrow the side of the face and make the inner face come out more take a photo with the back camera from like 10 feet
 
LebenistneHure

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And you want to be even narrower? Take a picture arms distance
These were pics at an arms distance...
 
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yeah camera distortion tends to narrow the side of the face and make the inner face come out more take a photo with the back camera from like 10 feet
Yeah, I suppose that could work.
 
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These were pics at an arms distance...
Then that's how you look trust me. You don't want to narrow your face you want to widen it

I was imaging someone with abnormally large zygos that would look better shaved
 
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yeah camera distortion tends to narrow the side of the face and make the inner face come out more take a photo with the back camera from like 10 feet
Yeah, here we go. You can see the full extent of my fucked up ES here. Also, my nose doesn't look bulbous in this picture at all, and I still look like shit. @RealSurgerymax


Mine. Is 63
You've sent me your pic, you look way to good to be on this forum mate.
 
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LebenistneHure

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Then that's how you look trust me. You don't want to narrow your face you want to widen it

I was imaging someone with abnormally large zygos that would look better shaved
Check out the post above...
 
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Just proved my point, you'd look better with more zygos and width
Honest to God, do I look better in the last pic? Cause I prefer the first one...
 
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Not even capping your midface doesn’t even seem to be an issue
 
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Honest to God, do I look better in the last pic? Cause I prefer the first one...
The first one looks better but that's because the lighting hides blemishes. Second is most likely what you actually resemble
 
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Pictures are worth a thousand words...

Several surgeries can help by actually increasing Interpupillary Distance and give balance to ES Ratio. They are all still big surgeries but less than an orbital box osteotomy (all procedures listed here are SUBcranial) -
  • Facial Tripartite
  • Lateral Orbital Wall Decompression + Medial Orbital Wall Bone Graft + Superiolateral Orbital Rim Shave + BOB Canthoplasty
  • Maxillary U-Shaped Osteotomy
  • Subcranial Facial Bipartition (LeFort III Bipartition)
  • Potentially SAD (Spring-Assisted Distraction) Frontoplasty with MSE (The SAD Frontoplasty is only successful in infants in children but maybe it will expand MSE expansion higher up. At worst it will probably do nothing...)

Illusions include nasal bridge narrowing. Botox to temploralis muscle may help some people. Weight loss seems to always help.

Maybe one of these solutions applies to you...
changing pfl through surgery also possible right?

thanks for detailed post btw.:)
 
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Alright, here. I hope I was able to present what I mean by different lighting. In one image it appears I have tiny cheekbones, midface doesn't look all too flat, and my nose appears to be a bit more narrow. In the other pic, completely opposite. Also, I tried doing the meme where I hold the phone as far away as I can, but you can still see my ears are almost sticking to the sides of my head, and that's not what it's like irl, so yes there has again been some distortion. This is as good as I can get it. So again, imagine my ES is slighty worse than this, because to myself, I look way better in pictures than in the mirror, precisely because of this minor ES improvement my camera "provides".




@RealSurgerymax
I didn't realize you posted a picture. You look good and barely have any zygos to shave off. If you only get one surgery it should be something to fix the under eye like an infraorbit implant or fat injection. Your eyes aren't noticeably narrow and it's better for your face to be a bit too wide than too narrow.
 
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Alright, here. I hope I was able to present what I mean by different lighting. In one image it appears I have tiny cheekbones, midface doesn't look all too flat, and my nose appears to be a bit more narrow. In the other pic, completely opposite. Also, I tried doing the meme where I hold the phone as far away as I can, but you can still see my ears are almost sticking to the sides of my head, and that's not what it's like irl, so yes there has again been some distortion. This is as good as I can get it. So again, imagine my ES is slighty worse than this, because to myself, I look way better in pictures than in the mirror, precisely because of this minor ES improvement my camera "provides".




@RealSurgerymax
have you measured your ipd? i don't think its a good idea for you to shave your zygos tbh. I have very wide zygos and I need bizygomatic reduction. From the earlier replies just like you, I thought MSE would make my zygos even wider but I guess not it might improve IPD?
 
LebenistneHure

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have you measured your ipd? i don't think its a good idea for you to shave your zygos tbh. I have very wide zygos and I need bizygomatic reduction. From the earlier replies just like you, I thought MSE would make my zygos even wider but I guess not it might improve IPD?
My IPD is 60mms. Dude I'd so love for mse increasing IPD to be true. Unfortunately, I'm sceptical about that. I literally need a couple of mms to look normal. Born in the wrong time I guess.
 
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@RealSurgerymax here is the thread
 
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I've come to realization that the reason my face looks off to me in the mirror is because my face is too wide laterally. I'd look fine if I could remove about 3-5mms off each side, like zygo shaving. Problem is, my zygos barely protrude, maybe like 2 mms max. There is no possibility of further reduction than that, right? I'd have to shave the top side of my skull jfl
Best surgeons for bimax?
 

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