Is there such a thing as too much undereye support? ie. Too much infraorbital rim?

[JawsOfLife]

I'm planning some infraorbital rim & extended zygo implants to correct my terrible terrible midface deficiency.

I'm trying to figure out how much to put in there.

Is there such a thing as too much undereye support or midface prominence? I don't know if I've ever seen it.

When I think of the race with the greatest midface support, it's probably Asians. Eg. This Asian just had upper eyelid fillers, but look at the undereye area:

Asians have so much support under their eyes that it is basically all smooth and flat all the way down. Is this a bad thing? I have actually always liked that about Asian faces. Maybe it's because I have such an imploded midface.

But for example, you can see a typical ethnic/white midface with augmentation here:

Make Me Heal - Plastic Surgery News, Cosmetic Surgery, Article, Skin Care, Antiaging, Beauty, Press, Report, Recovery

While he looks very good, I don't think it would have hurt him to go even further.

Can you post an example of someone with TOO MUCH infraorbital bone/prominence? Does such a thing even exist?

 

[MD_Hopeful69]

Fucking legit post. Probably need custom rim implant. My infraobritals are recessed to hell and hopefully taban will be able to get good orbtislcrims
What’s interesting tho is they have the best infraobrital rims bar none but yet their eyes are not deep set. Goes to show supraobrital rims are more important in depth of eye within a socket

Fucking legit post. Probably need custom rim implant. My infraobritals are recessed to hell and hopefully taban will be able to get good orbtislcrims
What’s interesting tho is they have the best infraobrital rims bar none but yet their eyes are not deep set. Goes to show supraobrital rims are more important in depth of eye within a socket

Also nasal bridge and shape of eye socket plays a role. Maybe caucaoids just have genetically a deeper position

 

[Deleted member 1680]

I'm planning some infraorbital rim & extended zygo implants to correct my terrible terrible midface deficiency.

I'm trying to figure out how much to put in there.

Is there such a thing as too much undereye support or midface prominence? I don't know if I've ever seen it.

When I think of the race with the greatest midface support, it's probably Asians. Eg. This Asian just had upper eyelid fillers, but look at the undereye area:

Asians have so much support under their eyes that it is basically all smooth and flat all the way down. Is this a bad thing? I have actually always liked that about Asian faces. Maybe it's because I have such an imploded midface.

But for example, you can see a typical ethnic/white midface with augmentation here:

Make Me Heal - Plastic Surgery News, Cosmetic Surgery, Article, Skin Care, Antiaging, Beauty, Press, Report, Recovery

While he looks very good, I don't think it would have hurt him to go even further.

Can you post an example of someone with TOO MUCH infraorbital bone/prominence? Does such a thing even exist?

Fucking legit post. Probably need custom rim implant. My infraobritals are recessed to hell and hopefully taban will be able to get good orbtislcrims
What’s interesting tho is they have the best infraobrital rims bar none but yet their eyes are not deep set. Goes to show supraobrital rims are more important in depth of eye within a socket

Also nasal bridge and shape of eye socket plays a role. Maybe caucaoids just have genetically a deeper position

High iq

 

[MD_Hopeful69]

High iq

thx fellow chadpreet

 

[JawsOfLife]

Fucking legit post. Probably need custom rim implant. My infraobritals are recessed to hell and hopefully taban will be able to get good orbtislcrims
What’s interesting tho is they have the best infraobrital rims bar none but yet their eyes are not deep set. Goes to show supraobrital rims are more important in depth of eye within a socket

Also nasal bridge and shape of eye socket plays a role. Maybe caucaoids just have genetically a deeper position

Well I think that's the main difference between non-Asians and Asians in judging this matter. Asians ALSO have very flat supraorbital rims. So it's smooth all the way down from forehead to their chin. Again, I've actually liked this about Asians.

But this is not the case for non-SEA types. Non-SEA races tend to have stronger supraorbital rims in general even when the infraorbitals are terribly retruded. eg. I have a very prominent supraorbital rim but zero infraorbital rims, which is what creates the typical white/brown sunken eyes look.

The only problem I could imagine with enhancing the infraorbital rim too much in someone who also has a strong supraorbital rim is that it might make the eyes look very "sunken" or "beady". But again, I'm not sure if this is even a real risk.

eg. I was watching Rim of the World and I immediately noticed one of the actors for his incredibly powerful undereye support:

His name is Dean Jagger, and he probably has the strongest undereye support I've ever seen, or at least since I've been paying attention, in a non-Asian. Plus he has a powerful supraorbital rim.

If you look at some pictures of him (see here), his eyes do look a bit small/beady at times, but he has an INSANE amount of bone both over and under there. I mean to get that much implant if you're starting from a point of retrusion would require so much silicone you probably couldn't even do it properly.

So I'm thinking maybe there is no real "risk" of overdoing this. If the worst risk is you look like that guy, I'd take it. He looks powerful as fuck.

What do you think? Am I interpreting this wrong? Seems very hard or impossible to get "too much bone" here.

Almost like for most men, there's almost no such thing as too low of a hairline (see here). Some things just look more impressive the more you have them (until it reaches total absurdity).

 

[MD_Hopeful69]

Well I think that's the main difference between non-Asians and Asians in judging this matter. Asians ALSO have very flat supraorbital rims. So it's smooth all the way down from forehead to their chin. Again, I've actually liked this about Asians.

But this is not the case for non-SEA types. Non-SEA races tend to have stronger supraorbital rims in general even when the infraorbitals are terribly retruded. eg. I have a very prominent supraorbital rim but zero infraorbital rims, which is what creates the typical white/brown sunken eyes look.

The only problem I could imagine with enhancing the infraorbital rim too much in someone who also has a strong supraorbital rim is that it might make the eyes look very "sunken" or "beady". But again, I'm not sure if this is even a real risk.

eg. I was watching Rim of the World and I immediately noticed one of the actors for his incredibly powerful undereye support:

His name is Dean Jagger, and he probably has the strongest undereye support I've ever seen, or at least since I've been paying attention, in a non-Asian. Plus he has a powerful supraorbital rim.

If you look at some pictures of him (see here), his eyes do look a bit small/beady at times, but he has an INSANE amount of bone both over and under there. I mean to get that much implant if you're starting from a point of retrusion would require so much silicone you probably couldn't even do it properly.

So I'm thinking maybe there is no real "risk" of overdoing this. If the worst risk is you look like that guy, I'd take it. He looks powerful as fuck.

What do you think? Am I interpreting this wrong? Seems very hard or impossible to get "too much bone" here.

Almost like for most men, there's almost no such thing as too low of a hairline (see here). Some things just look more impressive the more you have them (until it reaches total absurdity).

Yeah. I prefer the pretty boy eye look. Because It would look not conservative if I came back with hunter eyes.

 

[JawsOfLife]

Here's another good example of what I mean:

https://looksmax.org/threads/17-62-rate-me-body-face.17039/#post-326758

This guy has so much undereye support his eyes are almost sunken in. Yet it looks very good and like a classic "male model" look.

So in fact I think this guy:

Make Me Heal - Plastic Surgery News, Cosmetic Surgery, Article, Skin Care, Antiaging, Beauty, Press, Report, Recovery

Could have augmented even more with a full infraorbital/zygo implant and it would have just given him even more aggressively impressive results.

 

[mesr]

Most asians dont have too much undereye support. The eyes are actually protrusive when viewed from the side profile.

The more you augment the more chance it looks unnatural. Way better to be undercorrected than overcorrected

 

[Redrighthand]

No

 

[Deleted member 1680]

Here's another good example of what I mean:

https://looksmax.org/threads/17-62-rate-me-body-face.17039/#post-326758

This guy has so much undereye support his eyes are almost sunken in. Yet it looks very good and like a classic "male model" look.

So in fact I think this guy:

Make Me Heal - Plastic Surgery News, Cosmetic Surgery, Article, Skin Care, Antiaging, Beauty, Press, Report, Recovery

Could have augmented even more with a full infraorbital/zygo implant and it would have just given him even more aggressively impressive results.

@tincelw

 

[JawsOfLife]

Most asians dont have too much undereye support. The eyes are actually protrusive when viewed from the side profile.

The more you augment the more chance it looks unnatural. Way better to be undercorrected than overcorrected

I don't believe this is correct. Though I would love to hear you try to argue your position for clarity.

Here are some examples of typical white undereye area:

Now here are some typical Asians:

On average from what I observe, Asian men have a much fuller and smoother undereye area while even top white male models like Gandy have a bit of a sunken area here. Yes you can cherrypick examples from either race, but OVERALL, I think this is true.

It is also true SE Asians are the only race of people who will actively shave down their zygos because they have so much there they don't even want it all. The entire zygomatic arch is by far the biggest in SE Asians all the way around. It's what gives them such smooth midfaces.

The SE Asian zygo is imperfect primarily because it doesn't cut from a high angle, but rather it's smooth and large all the way down which gives the face a softer look. But I think the great support it provides is undoubtedly part of what makes SE Asians look so eternally youthful. They almost never get sunken undereyes or saggy cheeks.

 

[mesr]

you are correct but i still dont think its the infraorbital bone thats forward. in the majority of asians the infraorbital bone is behind the eyeball

asians have strong maxillas. so much so that a lot of them are bimax cases. if its not bimax its a very good trait though. it pushes all the soft tissue of the face forward. even if the cheekbones are flat, the maxilla pushes the soft tissue there forward

the first guy looks like he actually has good undereye support. most commonly seen in SE asians. gao has minor undereye issues in candid photos. what most asians have though is like the 3rd or 5th guy. protrusive eye, flat undereye, strong maxilla.

 

[JawsOfLife]

you are correct but i still dont think its the infraorbital bone thats forward. in the majority of asians the infraorbital bone is behind the eyeball

asians have strong maxillas. so much so that a lot of them are bimax cases. if its not bimax its a very good trait though. it pushes all the soft tissue of the face forward. even if the cheekbones are flat, the maxilla pushes the soft tissue there forward

the first guy looks like he actually has good undereye support. most commonly seen in SE asians. gao has minor undereye issues in candid photos. what most asians have though is like the 3rd or 5th guy. protrusive eye, flat undereye, strong maxilla.

View attachment 71929

Well keep in mind the zygo and infraorbital are a continuous element:

There is not much way to distinguish between the two. The zygomatic arch in SE Asians is I think almost certainly the largest of all the races on average. That is how you get surgeries like this:

Nowhere else on earth will you see this type of thing so commonly. Some hardcore dark black Africans seem to have a similar phenotype, but look at that chick's before. She probably has 5x as much zygo bone mass as I do. It's not at all uncommon for SEA men/women to have that degree of zygo mass. That's why they're the only country on earth where both the women and men are paying to shave their cheekbones down.

Everywhere else on earth women want cheekbone implants because they usually have none. It's not just a "cultural thing". Look at that example. The girl looked like a brick before and a pretty woman after. You won't find many girls in other races that would benefit from that type of work. Yeah most of her benefit came from the jaw, and she could have kept the zygos (that's partly cultural) but the genetic part is the fact that she had such massive zygos to begin with.

Big zygos are almost exactly the same as good infraorbitals because as I said they are a continuous element. It could be theoretically possible to have wide projecting zygos but recessed infraorbitals, but overall that's less likely. Since if you have a large amount of zygo bone growth, it's likely to grow in all directions and support everything.

I don't think it's a matter of maxillary alignment, because many guys get LF1s for example that bring their maxilla forward, yet they look horrible after because they have no undereye support. The smoothness of Asian faces comes from the lack of supraorbital projection (minimally forward brow ridges) and strong zygo/infraorbital support. Most other races have a prominent forehead, then a relatively sunken midface, then a prominent jaw. But with SE Asians it's relatively the same all the way down. This is bad for their browridges and jawlines, but good for their midfaces and I am again convinced this is largely what makes them eternally youthful.

For perspective, this is what happens when you overdo a white guy's midface treatment. I'm guessing he was gay and wanted to be partly feminized. But you can see as you fill in the midface with implants and then fat fillers it becomes incredibly smooth and ageless:

Figure 6 from Secondary malar implant surgery. | Semantic Scholar

Fig. 6. A 26-year-old man underwent facial skeletal augmentation with malar, paranasal, infraorbital rim, and mandibular body implants. A lateral canthopexy and rhinoplasty were also performed. He later underwent fat injections to his periorbital, midface, and chin and mandibular areas. Note the...

www.semanticscholar.org

I can agree that some Asians look bugeyed. I think this is a matter of point of reference. Ie. If you judge their infraorbitals relative to the eyeball, which is correct, and they have a buggy eyeball, then the infraorbital will seem recessed. But if you judge their infraorbitals relative to their whole face, then the infraorbital will seem quite advanced irrespective of the eyeball, as compared to everything else it's still very far forward.

Perhaps that's the discrepancy.