Working on MSE and MSDO myself

Julian

Julian

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So I don't have many shekels won't go to a ortho and its not available anyway. Got these 2 things. Ill cut a piece and use the front upper part for a facepuller gotta pull that maxilla like 3mm forward also lower front part for the mandible ill see if I can attach those can use some more forward growth. Then the back parts will be used for MSE and MSDO. I like to expand them at the same time.

I know its plastic yeah but its fucking strong as fuck. See the plastic. For reference the left one is lower teeth and the right one is upper. The gap between the upper teeth is 4cm aka 40mm. Shit pic but only shows the plastic things anyway. I've tried the max expension of the plastic and its 8mm ending with 48mm also got braces BEHIND my teeth to keep them in place and not make a giant gap between my teeth.

1580075525038


Ill try to screw some metal in to attach it and make it press outwards for the MSE/MSDO.
 
  • Hmm...
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Bro doe dit alsjeblieft niet ik ken Nederlandse orthos die MSE aanbieden
 
I don't get it. Are you going to screw in the mse yourself? and then cut your jaw in half for the msdo all on your own? Can you livestream it?
 
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Good luck but just know this isn’t MSE or MSDO.
It’s just an (admittedly strong) upper and lower palate expander.

An analogy would be calling a homemade Italian fast car a Ferrari. It’s not.
 
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nono I'm not gonna put a screw through my face. I came up with a new way and I'm pretty 99,99% sure it will work
Good luck but just know this isn’t MSE or MSDO.
It’s just an (admittedly strong) upper and lower palate expander.

An analogy would be calling a homemade Italian fast car a Ferrari. It’s not.

Yeah wallmart MSE/MSDO
 
nono I'm not gonna put a screw through my face. I came up with a new way and I'm pretty 99,99% sure it will work


Yeah wallmart MSE/MSDO
r.i.p a true american hero
 
nono I'm not gonna put a screw through my face. I came up with a new way and I'm pretty 99,99% sure it will work


Yeah wallmart MSE/MSDO
No,

MSE is screwed into your palate, and basically rips the suture apart
, then expands to create new bone in the new space created. It’s also the only method/appliance shown to be capable to even cause facial width increase as high up as the zygos.

And MSDO is a process that starts by slicing your chin in half, then placing an expander at the cut, and expanding to create new bone there.

What you’re doing is almost certainly better than nothing. But relating it to MSE or MSDO at all is dumb and will only confuse people. If you get mediocre results, they can use you as a case study for “why MSE/MSDO is overrated” when in reality, what you’re doing is similar to MSE in the same way a cheap homemade Italian car
 
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No,

MSE is screwed into your palate, and basically rips the suture apart
, then expands to create new bone in the new space created. It’s also the only method/appliance shown to be capable to even cause facial width increase as high up as the zygos.

And MSDO is a process that starts by slicing your chin in half, then placing an expander at the cut, and expanding to create new bone there.

What you’re doing is almost certainly better than nothing. But relating it to MSE or MSDO at all is dumb and will only confuse people. If you get mediocre results, they can use you as a case study for “why MSE/MSDO is overrated” when in reality, what you’re doing is similar to MSE in the same way a cheap homemade Italian car

100% right
 
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Good luck but just know this isn’t MSE or MSDO.
It’s just an (admittedly strong) upper and lower palate expander.

An analogy would be calling a homemade Italian fast car a Ferrari. It’s not.
Is it a common orthodontic procedure to expand just the arches (ie not a marpe type procedure)?
 
No,

MSE is screwed into your palate, and basically rips the suture apart
, then expands to create new bone in the new space created. It’s also the only method/appliance shown to be capable to even cause facial width increase as high up as the zygos.

And MSDO is a process that starts by slicing your chin in half, then placing an expander at the cut, and expanding to create new bone there.

What you’re doing is almost certainly better than nothing. But relating it to MSE or MSDO at all is dumb and will only confuse people. If you get mediocre results, they can use you as a case study for “why MSE/MSDO is overrated” when in reality, what you’re doing is similar to MSE in the same way a cheap homemade Italian car
Hmm. So given that mse is the only method shown to increase width as high up as zygos, would that mean palate expansion (younger ages) wont do this?
 
Hmm. So given that mse is the only method shown to increase width as high up as zygos, would that mean palate expansion (younger ages) wont do this?
No I was referring to an adult age population.

Normal appliance based palate expansion can even increase IPD in individuals in the younger side of the growing phase.

Is it a common orthodontic procedure to expand just the arches (ie not a marpe type procedure)?
Yes. You’d just use a removable appliance like DNA, biobloc, homeobloc, trombone, etc.

Mike Mew for example does in fact treat adult patients, but really only for arch expansion, not for the kind of radical forward growth change he’s known to be able to give to children.
 
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No I was referring to an adult age population.

Normal appliance based palate expansion can even increase IPD in individuals in the younger side of the growing phase.


Yes. You’d just use a removable appliance like DNA, biobloc, homeobloc, trombone, etc.

Mike Mew for example does in fact treat adult patients, but really only for arch expansion, not for the kind of radical forward growth change he’s known to be able to give to children.
I may have to settle for this. I would love MSE but I suspect I am not a candidate. My bite is good all the way to the molars. If I'm right, then no ortho would 'overexpand' the upper palate, with a view to expanding the lower palate in a separate surgery.

At the very least, I want an 8 tooth smile as opposed to 6 teeth.
 
I may have to settle for this. I would love MSE but I suspect I am not a candidate. My bite is good all the way to the molars. If I'm right, then no ortho would 'overexpand' the upper palate, with a view to expanding the lower palate in a separate surgery.

At the very least, I want an 8 tooth smile as opposed to 6 teeth.

wait holy fuck 6 teeth? I can see 12 already lol
 
I may have to settle for this. I would love MSE but I suspect I am not a candidate. My bite is good all the way to the molars. If I'm right, then no ortho would 'overexpand' the upper palate, with a view to expanding the lower palate in a separate surgery.

At the very least, I want an 8 tooth smile as opposed to 6 teeth.
There are a few that would do both MSE for upper and either a removable appliance for lower, or something like MSDO/SFOT (actually results in bone change) in the lower.

Ronald Ead got MSE for upper, and is now getting SFOT for the lower to “catch up”.

It’s admittedly more rare, and more orthos will say “what why— what’s even the point?” But all this means is they’re behind the curve. I know Ron’s ortho, Nawaz is one of the more forward thinking orthos, as well as Sylvain Chamberlain for example (he does MSDO and apparently has wanted to do, or has already done, a few patients with MSE and MSDO together)
 
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well it SHOULD be? Go to your dentist he might be able to get you MSE
I will still explore possibility of MSE but 1) very hard to find a practitioner 2) not sure I'm a candidate
H
There are a few that would do both MSE for upper and either a removable appliance for lower, or something like MSDO/SFOT (actually results in bone change) in the lower.

Ronald Ead got MSE for upper, and is now getting SFOT for the lower to “catch up”.

It’s admittedly more rare, and more orthos will say “what why— what’s even the point?” But all this means is they’re behind the curve. I know Ron’s ortho, Nawaz is one of the more forward thinking orthos, as well as Sylvain Chamberlain for example (he does MSDO and apparently has wanted to do, or has already done, a few patients with MSE and MSDO together)
This is good information. Thanks. How interested in aesthetics are these orthos? I would happily travel to the states at least to consult with them. I just wonder if my functional issues are severe enough to qualify. My tongue is too big for my upper-arch for example, so I can't mew properly. Hopefully they wpuld see this as treatable.
 
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I will still explore possibility of MSE but 1) very hard to find a practitioner 2) not sure I'm a candidate
H
This is good information. Thanks. How interested in aesthetics are these orthos? I would happily travel to the states at least to consult with them. I just wonder if my functional issues are severe enough to qualify. My tongue is too big for my upper-arch for example, so I can't mew properly. Hopefully they wpuld see this as treatable.
Yes if your tongue is too “big” this would be a good reason. And I’m fairly sure Sylvain chamberlain is very aesthetics oriented. He’s located in Quebec, and I believe Nawaz is in New York.
 
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Tongue too big/palate too narrow, one or the other.

I found Chamberland but not Nawaz, got his first name?
Tongue too big/palate too narrow, one or the other.

I found Chamberland but not Nawaz, got his first name?

@Golden Glass
 
Yes if your tongue is too “big” this would be a good reason. And I’m fairly sure Sylvain chamberlain is very aesthetics oriented. He’s located in Quebec, and I believe Nawaz is in New York.
Chamberlain denied me MDSO after MSE with another ortho, he is not blackpilled sadly
 
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Tongue too big/palate too narrow, one or the other.

I found Chamberland but not Nawaz, got his first name?


@Golden Glass
I forgot it, but Ronald Ead mentions his full name in his blog and YouTube channel.
 
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I will still explore possibility of MSE but 1) very hard to find a practitioner 2) not sure I'm a candidate
H
This is good information. Thanks. How interested in aesthetics are these orthos? I would happily travel to the states at least to consult with them. I just wonder if my functional issues are severe enough to qualify. My tongue is too big for my upper-arch for example, so I can't mew properly. Hopefully they wpuld see this as treatable.

Where are you from? PM me, maybe I can help you
 
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Chamberlain denied me MDSO after MSE with another ortho
Did he say your lower arch was fine?
Elab on the reasons he gave.

He’s publicly said on his Facebook he was going to do start doing both MSE and MSDO in the same patient last year.


Where are you from? PM me, maybe I can help you
@Sergio-OMS would love to Pm you as well. I have X-rays
 
Did he say your lower arch was fine?
Elab on the reasons he gave.

He’s publicly said on his Facebook he was going to do start doing both MSE and MSDO in the same patient last year.



@Sergio-OMS would love to Pm you as well. I have X-rays
Sure, no problem. Glad to give my two cents
 
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just completely destroy your face for minimal gains theory because of an aspie thread you read online theory
 
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just completely destroy your face for minimal gains theory because of an aspie thread you read online theory

How’s this destroying your face?
 
its a hyperbole. he doesnt know what hes doing, hes not a dentist, so the odds of him fucking this up is very high

Ah I thought you were talking about palate expansion lol. I agree doing this without a dentist has a high chance of ruining you.
 
Did he say your lower arch was fine?
Elab on the reasons he gave.

He’s publicly said on his Facebook he was going to do start doing both MSE and MSDO in the same patient last year.



@Sergio-OMS would love to Pm you as well. I have X-rays
Yes he said my lower arch didn't warrant MDSO
he will do MSE and MSDO if you fit his utter subhuman standards, over being very overcrowded still WORTH a try
What did he say to you?
MDSO wasn't warranted for my case because my lower arch was normal in his view, he said I should relapse my expansion with MSE to fit my lower arch better
 
Yes he said my lower arch didn't warrant MDSO
he will do MSE and MSDO if you fit his utter subhuman standards, over being very overcrowded still WORTH a try

MDSO wasn't warranted for my case because my lower arch was normal in his view, he said I should relapse my expansion with MSE to fit my lower arch better
Damn, in that case the best solution is just a trombone/hyrax/other expander for lower arch.
 
@BigBoy low T if u wouldnt :lul:
 
Damn, in that case the best solution is just a trombone/hyrax/other expander for lower arch.
trombone/hyrax won't widen chin, LOOKING for more surgeons rn SOMEBODY has to do MDSO
 
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trombone/hyrax won't widen chin, LOOKING for more surgeons rn SOMEBODY has to do MDSO
Ah if you want a wider chin then yes, you need MSDO, or maybe a type of osteotomy
 
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