russia already won the war in ukraine

[radicalrationalist]

they wanted the donbas, now they hold it along with mariupul too extended to kherson. their defenses have so far been impenetrable, ukraine no longer has the resources or manpower to launch any attacks greater than the already repelled spring/summer offensive. this means they have no ability whatsoever to regain any territory they have already lost. meanwhile russia is days away from fulling cutting off avdiika:



mariupol has already been rebuilt under russian occupation and has fully accepted their new identity as part of russia:



i think the war may be over soon. once avdiika falls, there will be a more territorial gain on their advance on dnipro and kharkov, ukraine will be pressured by nato to accept a ceasefire agreement that allows russia to keep donbas, crimea, and some of their newly gained territories because if they don't, russia will keep advancing beyond dnipro and be in a better position to demand even more concessions.

 

[tragic]

No one gives a fuck

 

[radicalrationalist]

No one gives a fuck

iq requirement for thread is 105, please make your way to the exit, thank you.

 

[TheBrownOne]

Russia could nuke that place and Id feel the same as I did before
Post this on instagram or sumn

 

[Luffymaxxing]

Good Putin must destroy the west

 

[radicalrationalist]

Good Putin must destroy the west

russia has run one of the more restrained wars in the modern era. it's funny seeing western media seethe and cry about every civilian building that gets hit by shrapnel in their desperate attempt to portray the opposite. the west are the new commies.

 

[HeightPilledum]

I'm okay with that, though they shouldn't stop at Adiivka. They should keep going
The ENTIRE Donbass needs to be Russian, not just some bombed cities

 

[standardcel]

The west needs to give more weapons to Ukraine

 

[radicalrationalist]

The west needs to give more weapons to Ukraine

it won't help them, you need training to be effective with those weapons, even then they lack the manpower to sustain combat operations, they are getting pushed back. the west is honestly barely even invested at this point. many reports from ukrainian troops that the equipment they receive from nato is out dated, poorly maintained, and broken. basically just sending them junk lol

 

[The Grinch]

 

[Veganist]

hello my deer friends. In today's summary, Russia successfully advanced into a small cornfield after 47 days of sieging it and losing 5000 men 200 pieces of equipment and 1000 tons of ammo. That is the end of today's summary, subscribe to our channel and click the notification button to not miss all the earth-shaking news from the front.

 

[Deleted member 18522]

over for ukraine

 

[abeilletoimême]

they wanted the donbas, now they hold it

They don't hold shit, a significant part of Donetsk region is held by Ukraine

too extended to kherson

Bro Russians had to flee Kherson more than a year ago because they got their arses kicked, WTF are you talking about JFL

if they don't, russia will keep advancing beyond dnipro and be in a better position to demand even more concessions.

You might as well predict that Russians will then march straight on London and Washington, if you're so much into delusionmaxxing. Douglas MacGregor-tier analysis

 

[orangomango2003]

it won't help them, you need training to be effective with those weapons, even then they lack the manpower to sustain combat operations, they are getting pushed back. the west is honestly barely even invested at this point. many reports from ukrainian troops that the equipment they receive from nato is out dated, poorly maintained, and broken. basically just sending them junk lol

stop watching pro-russian propaganda. it is the russians who use outdated soviet equipment. if what you were saying is true ukraine would've lost the war years ago already but they're still holding ground, despite russia having a much larger army. this indicates ukraine has a more efficient army with better equipment.

NATO won't let russia keep the donbas. they will keep supporting ukraine economically and military until ukraine has taken it back, and if ukraine loses to the point where kiev and the western border are under russian control NATO will intervene.

 

[kebab]

stop watching pro-russian propaganda. it is the russians who use outdated soviet equipment. if what you were saying is true ukraine would've lost the war years ago already but they're still holding ground, despite russia having a much larger army. this indicates ukraine has a more efficient army with better equipment.

NATO won't let russia keep the donbas. they will keep supporting ukraine economically and military until ukraine has taken it back, and if ukraine loses to the point where kiev and the western border are under russian control NATO will intervene.

1. You need more troops when attacking than defending so obviously russia has suffered more casualties, however none of the casualties number is accurate.

2. They are both using outdated equipment although russian troops have a higher rate of old weapon usage.

3. ukraine only has better equipment because of their aids, the US alone has sent more than 70 BILLION dollars worth of equipment (almost 2x ukraines military spendings for 2021). now think about all the other countries and single manufacturers.

4. multiple countries have asked ukraine to make a peace agreement with russia to stop the war as they know that its a fucking money pit, and ukraine has refused. 5. Ukraine has started their « massive counter-offensive » about a year ago and it failed.


Truth is theres pretty much no unbiased media about the war as they all either used info given by russia and their allies or ukraine and their allies. The only ones that know the truth are the ones on the field and the ones that are actively involved.

 

[orangomango2003]

multiple countries have asked ukraine to make a peace agreement with russia to stop the war as they know that its a fucking money pit, and ukraine has refused. 5. Ukraine has started their « massive counter-offensive » about a year ago and it failed.

what countries have asked ukraine to make a peace agreement with russia? ukraine has offered peace agreements but russia refused.

"Deputy Kremlin Chief of Staff Dmitry Kozak said in 2022 that he had negotiated an agreement with Ukraine within a few days of the invasion. This settlement would have ended hostilities in exchange for guarantees that Ukraine would not join NATO. The agreement was however blocked by Putin, who "expanded his objectives to include annexing swathes of Ukrainian territory"

"In negotiations during March and April 2022, Ukraine was willing to consider a neutral status, wherein Ukraine would not join any military alliances or host forces of other nations on its territory. Reacting to Russian air strikes in December 2022, Ukrainian Foreign Minister Dmytro Kuleba said, "There can be no 'neutrality' in the face of such mass war crimes. Pretending to be 'neutral' equals taking Russia's side."

"In June 2023 Zelensky said Ukraine was not ready to negotiate with the Kremlin unless they withdrew their troops. He repeated this refusal in January 2024."

if russia does not leave ukraine there can be no peace obviously. you can't blame ukraine for the war since they are only defending themselves. if Mexico invaded Texas should the US just accept this as their loss so there can be peace? as long as russia doesn't stop the invasion there will be no peace. If the allies accepted a nazi victory in ww2 there wouldn't be peace, there would be opression and further invasions by germany.

 

[kebab]

what countries have asked ukraine to make a peace agreement with russia? ukraine has offered peace agreements but russia refused.

"Deputy Kremlin Chief of Staff Dmitry Kozak said in 2022 that he had negotiated an agreement with Ukraine within a few days of the invasion. This settlement would have ended hostilities in exchange for guarantees that Ukraine would not join NATO. The agreement was however blocked by Putin, who "expanded his objectives to include annexing swathes of Ukrainian territory"

"In negotiations during March and April 2022, Ukraine was willing to consider a neutral status, wherein Ukraine would not join any military alliances or host forces of other nations on its territory. Reacting to Russian air strikes in December 2022, Ukrainian Foreign Minister Dmytro Kuleba said, "There can be no 'neutrality' in the face of such mass war crimes. Pretending to be 'neutral' equals taking Russia's side."

both from more than a year ago

"In June 2023 Zelensky said Ukraine was not ready to negotiate with the Kremlin unless they withdrew their troops. He repeated this refusal in January 2024."

if russia does not leave ukraine there can be no peace obviously. you can't blame ukraine for the war since they are only defending themselves. if Mexico invaded Texas should the US just accept this as their loss so there can be peace? as long as russia doesn't stop the invasion there will be no peace. If the allies accepte

peace doesnt mean going back to pre-war. there will never be true peace anyways, both countries will have negative feelings towards each other however it will stop the bloodshed.

"Kyiv has dismissed and discredited a Nato aide for suggesting that Ukraine hand over territory to Russia as an appeasement to end the war. Stian Jenssen, chief of staff to Secretary General Jens Stoltenberg, proposed Ukraine surrender part of its territory to Russia in return for an invitation to join the western military alliance." this was in august 2023.

"The U.S. and Germany allegedly hope to nudge Ukraine to negotiate with Russia through a carefully targeted scope of arms deliveries, the German tabloid Bild reported on Nov. 24, citing an anonymous government source." november 2023

f Mexico invaded Texas should the US just accept this as their loss so there can be peace

when you ve been fighting for months over a few km of land without any progress, and have thousands of casualities and while using billions of foreign aid and weapons you should probably try to minimize further losses.

If the allies accepted a nazi victory in ww2 there wouldn't be peace, there would be opression and further invasions by germany.

this example doesnt apply. ceasefire/ "peace" =/= accepting other party's victory in this case. if ukraine surrendered the occupied land: 1. russian wont have accomplished their goal as the independant nation which is ukraine would still exist. 2. there would be no more bloodshed and further invasions as the war would come to an end. ceasefire/ treaty of peace =/= surrendering.

 

[czwarty]

two more weeks to do the needful sir

 

[abadaba]

thiz thread

 

[orangomango2003]

when you ve been fighting for months over a few km of land without any progress, and have thousands of casualities and while using billions of foreign aid and weapons you should probably try to minimize further losses.

this example doesnt apply. ceasefire/ "peace" =/= accepting other party's victory in this case. if ukraine surrendered the occupied land: 1. russian wont have accomplished their goal as the independant nation which is ukraine would still exist. 2. there would be no more bloodshed and further invasions as the war would come to an end. ceasefire/ treaty of peace =/= surrendering.

your logic is basically that if you get attacked by a stronger country you should surrender to minimize casualties. so eastern europe should surrender to russia until the soviet union is united again, good plan.

the billions of foreign aid are not wasted at all. we are defending europe, not just ukraine. if you let russia do whatever they want the liberal and democratic west as we know it will soon be gone. if ukraine surrenders the donbas and crimea to russia NATO will accept ukraine into NATO and a bigger war will be more likely with even more casualties. this is not likely since ukraine stance is to not surrender under any circumstance.

my point is that a ceasefire is not a solution to the conflict.

Ukraine war: why a ceasefire based on partition of territory won’t work

Russian and Ukrainian communists who in 1919 mapped out the border between Ukraine and Russia took as their starting point the former Russian empire’s provincial boundaries.

theconversation.com

 

[kebab]

your logic is basically that if you get attacked by a stronger country you should surrender to minimize casualties. so eastern europe should surrender to russia until the soviet union is united again

No. with all the aids russia and ukraine have a similar force. The resources and manpower that would be needed rn to reconquer the lost territory is insane.

the billions of foreign aid are not wasted at all.

Failed counter-attack and millions embezzled by ukrainian government sounds like waste to me. I mean obviously it wasnt a complete waste but zelensky was unable to properly use the totality of the aid.

the liberal and democratic west as we know it will soon be gone

good riddance (half-joke)

my point is that a ceasefire is not a solution to the conflict.

i dont believe that theres a « solution » to any war tbh. I just want the killing to stop and imo the best way to achieve that rn would be a treaty of peace that gives up some of the lost territory to russia. Sure it will only be a short-term solution but the ukraine war isnt really something that came out of the blue anyways, same goes for west-east conflict.

My whole point to begin with was that everything is propaganda and that we, in the west, see way more Ukraine biased propaganda that doesnt reflect the truth on the battlefield.

Overall my stance is that russian shouldn’t have attacked however we cant time travel so the best thing that could happen right now is a treaty of « peace ».

 

[bogushkilla]

That’s funny. Russia lost 400 tanks in avdiivka in a few weeks confirmed by a video, and they only advanced by 1km

 

[Skywalker]

No one gives a fuck

 

[EggKing]

They don't hold shit, a significant part of Donetsk region is held by Ukraine

Bro Russians had to flee Kherson more than a year ago because they got their arses kicked, WTF are you talking about JFL

You might as well predict that Russians will then march straight on London and Washington, if you're so much into delusionmaxxing. Douglas MacGregor-tier analysis

They fled on a organized way and was perhaps the only good decision took by the MoD during the ukrainian (failed btw) counteroffensive

 

[plutomadruga]

belgorod sleep?